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November 21, 2007

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David Hall

"It isn't true that no people can be gifted in all areas." - This just shows your lack of education.

You need an university education really badly and once you get it, then you can expand your views on the world.

No one is gifted in all areas. "gifted" people are pretty much supreme in 1 particular area.

e.g Maths, Sciences or Technology

I think you are the one who needs a University education because you are wrong. There are people who are gifted in all areas, it isn't many, but I know they exist because I have a few of them. They have been tested extremely gifted by the University of NSW and they are gifted across the board.

2ndly Why would your children be hard working if they are truly gifted? Most gifted people I know finished high school when they are 13 or 14.

Why doesnt your children accelerate to a quick start in university?

Obviously you want to present the picture that you want to present. The schools wouldn't meet thier obvious needs, they neglected them and they targeted and bullied them when I complained. Does that strike you as an environment where a child can excell?

David Hall

Dear Jolanda

I am a CAUCASION, Australian and I attended North Sydney Boys a few years back.

Schools with majority being Asian is only
1. James Ruse
2. Baulkham Hills
3. Sydney Boys
4. Sydney Girls
5. North Sydney Boys
6. North Sydney Girls
7. Sydney Technical
8. St George

The rest of them have great numbers of people from all races. Please dont assume that all these places are going towards Asians. Asians are smart btw, and they are an asset to a school because they work hard. Giftedness doesnt necessarily represent how hard a person works but only their ability in handling a particular subject.
No person can be gifted in all areas. Working hard is seen by many selective schools as 1 of the GREATEST gifts of all.

David what about the really hard working gifted child? Do you care about them? It isn't true that no people can be gifted in all areas. Certainly there are some but it isn't a majority.

I think a good strategic for you Jolanda is to simply go down to an academically selective school and check it out.
There are 3 stereotypes of selective schools that I find bothering.

1. Most people are coached. Infact most are not coached for a variety of reasons.

This is not true. The Principals of all the top Selective High Schools have publically said that the majority of the students were coached. The coaching colleges boast about the amount of kids that are successful from thier coaching clinics.

2. Most people are gifted/smart. There are smart and dumb people in every school just like how Private schools can have both rich and poor.

Many people are smart but only a certain number of them are gifted and even less are highly/exceptionally and profoundly gifted. You wont find to many 'poor' people in private schools as if they can afford a private school then they are not poor

3. Selective schools favour asians who have studying hard as embedded in their culture. In fact most asians just like other Australians do not go to Selective Schools nor private.

Selective Schools have a majority of students from Asian background. That is a fact.

If you want FULL fairness I suggest you move to Sweden or Denmark or Norway. I think they use a "lotery" system to apoint students to local schools based on luck and all public schools are treated equally.

Actually a lottery system would be fairer at least then it would be the luck of the draw as opposed to the luck of whom you are born to and how much money they have and who you know!

Australia has a right/left centralist government which is CAPITALIST. Capitalist nations always favour the rich over the poor. The powerful over the weak.

mmm...

You have stated in other blogs that you wish the "Selective High School System" to be removed and replaced by comprehensive schools with competitive "gifted" classes.

I see that as an extreme viewpoint because:

- What if your children were actually successful in getting in? Then you would obviously be supportive of Selective Schools

The Selective System, because it doesn't actually include gifted children is not supported by me. In the earlier days we were told by teachers in the public school system and principals that they didn't have the funding to cater for our children's needs as gifted children and that once they got to Opportunity Class and Selective HIgh Schools that things would be better for them. Of course then, despite the fact that they were obvious identified gifted children, they didn't let them in. Worse still they manipulated their scores and documents to keep them out. I would not support any school that functions in that manner.

Most people who did not gain selective entry would feel the same. Its called "jealousy" and unavoidable.

In this instance it isn't jelousy. The comprehensive system failed and neglected my children identified educational and social needs and then the Department of Education manipulated with my childrens marks and papers to discredit me and them because I complained about their education. I didn't make this up, this presented in documents produced under FOI

Finally I ask you. You say that coaching is unfair.
So assuming if I was a potential Olympic sprinter, should I train hard or simply run without getting coached?
Intellectual power can be improved just like physical power through coaching.

The Selective Schools application says that coaching is not necessary. The system is misleading parents and students and telling lies. The system is biased and corrupted and any education system run like that can only go backwards

Jolanda

1.Why,do.carry.this.issue.for.ever.and.ever?

Because documents produced under FOI show that my children's marks and applications are being and have been manipulated and tampered with in the Years 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006 and 2007 and we are not being afforded procedural fairness and natural justice and impartial and unbiased decisions. It is discrimination. You should be asking them why do they keep doing this to my children, not asking me why I complain about what they are doing to my children.

Most.students.who.undertake.tuition.NEVER.
ever.get.into.a.selective.schools
I.am.a.Chinese.Australian.who.went.to.both.OC.and.Selective.High.School(James.Ruse.
Agricultural.High.School)
Most.students.at.James.Ruse.have.an.IQ.way.above.your.daughters.My.IQ.is.over.170.

Good luck to you if you got in and you have an IQ that high and you were happy in school. My children were not happy, they were being neglected and victimised. Why do you feel it is okay for my children to be discriminated against.

I.am.not.rich.and.my.family.is.surely.far.
poor.than.u.are.You.argue.you.were.bullied.
Why.was.I.not.bullied.for.being
1.Chinese
2.Poor
3.Received.only.Distinctions.in.university.
competitions

I.saw.your.argument.a.year.back

You.said.1.of.your.daughters.always.got.
Distinction.in.competitions.
The.lowest.mark.in.James.Ruse.is.
Distinction.Almost.nobody.gets.credit.

The majority of students in James Ruse are coached and tutored to get into the school and are in one of the best learning environments. One would expect them to get Distinctions. My daughter should have gotten in too but her test results were manipulated, what part of that do you not understand?

Why.cant.you.just.let.it.go?Selective.School.doesn't.mean.anything.

When your children are depressed at school because the mismatch is so great and the attitudes are against them and is is impacting on their mental and physical health and wellbeing and the schools keep telling you that they dont have the funding to cater for them and things will get better when they get into Opportunity Class and Selective Schools it is devastating for the child when they miss out and have to consider the next 9 years of their life depressed and unhappy at school. It is even more devastating to find out that it was done on purpose and they are being victimised.

You want me to turn my back on my children and accept that treatment of my children?.....Not in this lifetime.

Also.what.I.find.racist.is.the.fact.you.
argued.all.people.should.speak.English.at.
schools.If.your.daughters.were.studying.in.China.and.met.an.Aussie.in.that.school.will you.stop.them.from.speaking.English?

These Asian students are not just studying English here, they are living here as citizens. Again I ask are you sure about your IQ? What test did they do because quite frankly I do not believe you. It seems that you must have the type of IQ that coaching/tutoring colleges produces.

One question did James Ruse teach you to put full stops after every word?

Oh and whoever you are, I went on to James Ruse website and what you say is not true, here are the facts in 2005.

Competitions:

Australian Schools English Competition
• 1 Medal, 103 High Distinctions, 368 Distinctions, 140 Credits
(630 awards out of 760 students)

Australian Schools Writing Competition
• 2 Medals , 21 High Distinctions, 81 Distinctions, 65 Credits
(169 out of 760)

Australian schools mathematics competition.
• 5 Medals, 198 High Distinctions, 384 Distinctions, 134 Credits
(716 out of 760)

Australasian Schools Science Competition
• 6 Medals –164 High Distinctions, 296 Distinctions, 77 Credits
(707 out of 760)

Australian Schools Computer Skills Competition
• 33 High Distinctions, 137 Distinctions, 83 Credits
(253 out of 760)

Oh and it is no wonder they do so well at that school they pick and choose extra’s at the end of year 9,10 and 11, up until year 12. No doubt students from Private schools or students who have been coached and tutored to perform highly are selected.

(Taken from website) Applicants must be permanent residents of N.S.W. and numbers are limited by accommodation to 120 in years 7 and 8 with an increase in Years 9, 10 and 11 to 160 by an intake of another 40 students. We do not take students into Year 12.

Harry Heidelberg

Jolanda this issue seems to be dragging on. It has been going on for years now. Soon it will be 2008.

Yes it has dragged on and yes it will drag on Harry as the Department desperately tries to cover up whilst continuing to neglect and target my children.

My youngest son John missed out on OC placement for next year, this is despite the fact that he struggled/struggles to cope in the comprehensive system as he is just too different. It is obvious that he is very smart and sensible and has an alternate focus and need. Thank God an out of area Catholic school has offered him a place otherwise he would have had to go back on Distance Education next year. It just seems amazing how much the Public Education system treasures these places in these special schools that are supposed to be for gifted and talented students. The public system cannot seem to be able to provide a place for public school students in obvious desperate need of a more appropriate learning environment and alternative? All they would need to do is pull up a chair.

At present our Director General has said that he doesn't believe it a conflict of interest/duties to allow those about whom you have made formal allegations against of bias, victimisation, manipulation and misconduct and that include allegations of a conspiracy to cover up to prepare the documents for a viewing in relation to matters pertaining to the matter. This is despite the fact that I have on numerous times requested that these people have nothing to do with my children or the complaints.

These people have changed Policies in order to avoid production and to cover up. They have destroyed documents specificially requested under FOI. They have falsified documents, lost documents, misplaced documents, prepared documents and even pretended documents do not exist. They have even previously produced documents, said to be from ACER and presented as being from ACER, that were later found in evidence to have been printed from the DET'S computers instead. Just to name a few . He does not agree that it would constitute a 'conflict of interests/duties' for these persons to handle the documents and issues pertaining to the complaints?

They say the complaints have been investigated yet they can provide no documentary evidence to suport that claim and on the basis of 'an advice' that the matters have been extensively investigated (by those we allege are covering the matter up) the matter has been deemed closed.

That is their intention, to drag it on and not afford us procedural fairness or natural justice because they know that the longer they can delay it the more people blame me.

They fail in their duty of care, they breach their policies, their code of conduct and even break the law and we get the punishment and the blame and our Governments will do nothing to protect the children - and of course the public pretty much dont care.

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